Freedom Domain
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.......* Hi Roger, how are you doing?
Roger : Oh, o.k..
* Well let's see, I just finished up my whole court thing that was going on down in Van Nuys. Do you remember that whole situation I went through? I was using the process after I had already made an agreement to plead guilty and everything and I was put on probation and had to take some classes or rather...goto some meetings... so uh, and I backed down after I had the probation officer on the stand and the judge threw me in jail and I didn't wait out the time period....and then what happened was...I was supposed to be on probation for 36 months and what I was supposed to do was...I had put the judge in a really bad position because see, I had already agreed to go do these meetings and he would have had to back down to everything in his courtroom there..so uh...I had agreed to go do these meetings and afterwards the attorney had mentioned to me that the judge would never forget that incident or something like that...he remembered me and had made a comment about it...but I just went in and I had the certificate, and the attorney wasn't there and a couple interesting things happened and I just wanted to run them by you and see what you thought about it.
Roger : O.k.
* One of the things was...well, of course, they had all of my acceptance paperwork and everything had been accepted and uh...I had written the letters to everyone etc., and I went in there, the public defender comes out and he got my paperwork, and he goes, "so did you goto the meetings", and I said "yes". We were out in the hallway, and he said, "well, o.k. just come on back in here". So the judge had called my name and I was approaching the bar, and the public defender was inside the bar and he goes "hold on, just wait a minute...stop right there!", as I was just about to enter the bar..."he says "hold on a second", and then he presented it to the judge and he says "he's done the classes, there's a certificate of completion here" and the judge says "o.k. that's good...and there's the matter of the follow-up with the probation officer..." and the public defender jumps in, he says "well, your honor, you know he uh..it's been 18 month now...", and actually it had only been about fifteen or sixteen months, and he said..., and I was supposed to be on probation for 36 months...I saw it on his paperwork, where I had just talked to him, and it was all up there and that's the impression I was under...and he says "It's been 18 months, would you like to dismiss this case at this time?" and the judge looks at the prosecutor and asks "Any comments?", and the prosecutor says "no",... "any objections?", the prosecutor says "no". He says "case dismissed".
Roger : O.k.
* And uh...A couple of the questions I had were, number one, I had gone through the bar every single other time I had gone to court. Do you think there is a particular reason why they kept me from going through the bar that time or do you think that's just standard procedure?
Roger : Well....you see...they..doing some of the things you were doing..is an acceptance in itself...because you didn't give them any static here on the impositions that they made on you. Where they start to do this where it's vixatious here...then they become the victims here of their own hand.
* Right.
Roger : So I think here, that you had not given them any cause to move any farther and if they had of here, they'd be moving against themselves. I think that would be the reason.
* Now, is a dismissal a standard thing that they do...when you've gone to their meetings and stuff that they wanted you to do and it's a followup thing.
Roger : Well, I don't know because I don't mess with the administrative procedures. But a dismissal to me is not a "win".
* Oh, yeah, I understand. I 've heard you say that before.
Roger : And uh...It's probably just a way for them to keep theirselves afloat here (cut off..."debts". ) (*From looking bad?)
Roger : No, not looking bad. To keep afloats here with the debts, see, otherwise, the debts get redeemed here and they don't have anything here to keep themselves afloat, if you want to say that.
* Well, do you think that they haven't actually adjusted my account? , that they still have my whole thing on their books?
Roger : Oh, sure. Yeah, they've got it on the books here.
* Because it seemd to me like they wanted to have nothing else to do with me, and I was supposed to be on probation for 36 months. My impression was that they wanted to make money off me for another 18 months.
Roger : Yeah, but you see, a probationary period is the period of time on which the property has to be returned to the principal. You've established yourself in there as that principal so you see, at the end of the probationary period that's when it's got to be returned to you.
* Right, but they cut it short. It was supposed to be 36 months and it's only been 16.
Roger : Yeah, well, if they've cut it short here, it's probably here to...float the debt somewhere. I don't know. I don't have the...
* Well, I just thought i'd run it by you and see if you had any opinion on it here.
Roger : Not really. There could be alot of things here... It's hard to keep up enough with just the facts here, yet alone speculate.
* O.k. You know also, I've been involved in that incident recently... a private incident where that person strangled me and I called you a couple weeks back on that. I had written up a little letter here, it's really short. You had given me the impression that maybe I didn't want to...maybe it wasn't in my best interest to set a monetary value...because it doesn't necessarily boil down to a monetary value.
Roger : Well, the thing is here..you're not going to put it in writing and tell him I want this much money or this is what this is worth...you see, because you start to set the stage here to do some testifying and crap like that. What I would tell him...write him a letter and tell him this is what I want here for ...remedy. My remedy. I request here your apology and blah, blah, blah, whatever it is, and you just tell him, and in the event here, you choose to refuse ot otherwise fail to provide me with the remedy I am requesting...I will accept your dishonor and liquidate the equity.
* O.k. How does this sound to you? Can I run this by you really quick?
Roger :: O.k.
* "As per our business agreement on such and such a date, whereby you placed your hands around my neck strangling me and leaving me bruised. I request my remedy. I request that you turn over all of your assets and possessions to me immediately or provide me with the locations of all of your assets including vehicle identification numbers and property descriptions. In the event that you refuse, I will accept your dishonor for value and proceed to recover my remedy through liquidation of your property to settle my claim. In the event that you dishonor and refuse to provide me my remedy as requested by voluntary means, you will agree to the alternative being involuntary bankryptcy. Thank you very much".
Roger : Well....I don't know if I would do that.
* O.k.
Roger : I think I would just tell him here that you want an apology, and you want...not him turn over all the assetts and one thing and another...(* o.k.)...the uh...I suppose, if you're gonna state here you have...What sort of monetary value here do you expect here that that incident provoked?
* Well, originally I asked him for $20,000 as my remedy....
Roger : Yeah, but why?
* For the bruising, for the stress...for the whole thing that I went through....
Roger : Well...I think you're treading here on dangerous waters here when you're gonna say here, "well you bruised me", or "you swore at me and that's gonna cost you $20,000. You see, I'll tell you...if you write that here it wouldn't surprise me that you'll have a prosecutor on you, prosecuting you for extortion...big time! (* Uh huh) You know...you could get some kind of big time sentence out of that and then you'de have to fight them on that basis. But you see, if you just tell him here, that you want an apology...a written apology, and uh...what else here did it cost you?
* Well, what did it cost me? In uh...It cost me alot of time. (Roger : O.k.) It cost me stress.
Roger : Forget the stress. (* O.k.) Just forget about that because that there is something that 's going to get you into big time trouble. (* O.k.) But you see...you do have some actuals. I mean...did you bring anything there of value that got destroyed?
* No, but to keep it from being destroyed, I ended up not being able to protect my neck.
Roger : To keep what from being destroyed?
* I had some plants in my hands. And I was going to drop them.
Roger : O.k. But the plants were for what? Did he order them?
* Yeah!
Roger : O.k., then you want to be paid for those plants. (O.k.) You know, even if you took them back, you see, you brought them there because you wanted to be paid for them. He was going to pay you for them? (* Yeah!) You want to be paid for the plants and you tell him that you want a written apology, and if he fails to do it, you will accept his dishonor and you will liquidate his equity. Now! Because you've got to establish a contract with him.
* Right. And all it takes is a simple...his simple refusal...(Roger : Yes!) ...to even provide me with that.
Roger : Yeah, but remember this now, his simple refusal you see, any commercial transactions are regulated by HJR-192. Voluntary bankruptcy. That's how come they call taxes voluntary. (* Right. O.k.) Because all of the exchanges in commerce here are voluntary exchanges. (* Right) .. O.k. But you see, now, when he fails to volunteer ...at your request...now you see, you're accepting his refusal...and now because of his refusal, he has contracted to the alternative, which is involuntary. (* O.k.) ..That's involuntary bankruptcy, which is the alternative. (* Right) And that's what you're telling him...that's what the equity is. You're going to take the equity. You're going to take him into invluntary bankruptcy, in other words, whatever he has got, you're going to take. (* Right)... But you see, you're not going to go out and tell him like you were going to, though, cause you'll invite an awful lot of trouble here over that.
* Well, thank you, I do appreciate that very much, and that's one of the reasons I called you, because I definitely value you're expertise.
Roger : O.k., well, now there is a way to go after everything he's got. If he's got a house, take the house and just get a property description and go down and list it through a realtor for sale. (* O.k.) ... The reason being here is that you own the equity. (* Right) Because you contracted with him. (* Right)... And you're not required to give him any more notice here than what we've just....(* Right. Got it.) Now, if he's got a car...same thing here, you can list the car for sale in a classified ad or you could uh...apply...get the description of the vehicle, if you can get the VIN number off of it and uh...license it.
* License it?
Roger : Yeah. Just apply here for registration. Register the vehicle and get a license on it.
* Oh!
Roger : You see...and that could probably happen and he'd even be driving it with the old license on it, but then, you see...(* When he get's pulled over...chuckling)...yeah, once he get's pulled over, and they match the VIN number here, and the license plates here don't...aren't current with the VIN number, he's got a problem. Those are some ways here you can move in, because you see...equity supercedes all the legal titles. (* Right)...so when you establish the fact of the matter...that you own the equity...then just act on it.
* You know, I was just speaking with Barbara a little while ago, she uh...I was mentioning that I was going to be contacting you, or attempting to today, and she wanted...she had a question she wanted to pose, briefly, it was...that she was curious to where in the UCC that it...she just wanted for documentation purposes, where in the UCC... you had mentioned to her that somewhere it says you can do that, where the IRS uses that to sell off our property and stuff...do you remember where that was specifically?
Roger : I never said that. (accidently blocked first word)...it's in the UCC. I mean the uh...I didn't say it was UCC. I said here that this was equity.
* Yeah. That's what I was..what I kept mentioning back and she just said, well, I don't know if you had mentioned...
Roger : Well, there's conditions in there, but you'd have to read the whole (word blocked accidently) You just need to understand what equity is and then just apply it here. The book I'm going to here is out of the bible. You see, because the invalid that's laying before the city gate here by the public pool, who's an invalid and he's asked why he doesn't go into the pool here to be healed. And his statement here is "I have no one to take me into the troubled waters". Well, were going to take these guys into the troubled waters...because we're going to take them into involuntary bankruptcy...
* Because he could have volunteered in....(Roger : Yeah) But he waited....
Roger : Yeah but you see, they're helpless. We have to do it for them.
* O.k. Well, i'm starting to understand that alot better. I had a collection agent...I had a phone bill I had paid for a girlfriend. I had moved out. It was like $700.00 and the collection company went after me, and I had volunteered to her to pay it off for her, and I paid them everything they wanted, and I just got a call...that was like 6 months ago, and I just got a call from them the other day, saying that there's $26.00 something such charge, and I said "where did that come from. I paid off everything". They said "Oh, that was the interest between the time we told you and the time you ended up paying it". And I said "well, I don't know why that wasn't included. Can you give me the total that it's going to be if I send it to you today, so that it's not $1.64 later, after I get it to you, between the next two days", and they said "well yeah, it's going to be $28.00 and such and such. So I'm going to do my firtst draft on that and I'm going to send it to them with an acceptance, and what I was curious about...there's the agent himself, and there's the company, and Barbara was just talking about how you can do...you can, say... if it's a court coming after you, you'de say "pay to" the court, but payable through the person like the prosecutor or whoever is...(Roger : Yeah.)... so, would I do a "pay to" like american agencies, which is the company, and "payable through" the agent who...his name...? (Roger : Yep) ...O.k.
Roger : But you put it in ALL CAPS because that's his strawman. You put it in ALL CAPS down there on the left hand corner of that draft.
* O.k. ... Yeah it's going to be my first one here and we'll see how that goes. And also there is another issue really quick. I ordered some bags, or rather some boxes from this bag company recently, and they just sent me something saying "thank you for choosing us for your packaging needs and we are updating our tax records for all customers that have California shipping address. We're obligated to collect and remit California sales tax on all qualified shipments. Please help us maintain accurate information regarding your company's tax status. Please fill out the attached exemption certificate, if applicable and return it. Finance department." and it says State of California General Exemption Certificate with a number written up on top, and i'm curious, uh, would my exemption with my registration through the UCC be applied to this and would I give them that number?
Roger : Just give them an acceptance. Because you're giving them your Employer I.D. number when you do, that's a tax exempt number...exemption number.
* O.k. So, this letter that they wrote me. I'd send this back "accepted" and write them a letter?
Roger : Put the accepted for value legend on there.
* O.k. and just send it right back?
Roger : Yeah. Because that's included here with the tax number that they are asking for. (* O.k.)... Yeah, that's all you need to do.
* It wouldn't have anything to do with my UCC filing number?
Roger : No.
* O.k. Because, we do actually use it on the draft, don't we?
Roger : Sure. But you see, that's to register here,...the products.
* I'm looking into any closed checking accounts right now, and I don't actually have one that I can find immediately, but I know I do have one, but I have to go through some things...alot of paperwork to find it right now. But, it's not going to be a problem to do it without that...you're just saying that that speeds up the process or helps them??? Or uh, what's the difference whether it has a routing number on it or not, with the uh...
Roger : Well, you don't have to worry about your draft having the...that's not comingled with the check here. It could be but it doesn't need to be.
* So, the routing number is not that important...(Roger : You don't need that) I know Barbara was mentioning that you said that it seems to speed up their ability to do their work that their trying to do...
Roger : Sometimes. But sometimes they use it as an excuse to hinder you here too, so...
* Oh, okay. ... So how is everything going with you, Roger?
Roger : Oh, just busy. I get weary, you know, but otherwise it's all going pretty good. I've got some big fish on the line here that i'm wrestling to the floor right now.
* Farm Credit Services?
Roger : No, not really...they aren't big fish here, they're just little...I've got a corporation that i've ordered some stuff for about eighty-thousand bucks...and I bought an other item here....I bought a tractor here the other day and i've got to wrestle those guys. I've got the tractor though. (* Oh!) ...I've got it on the premises here...and they put it up here with a draft...so.
* That's truly miraculous. It's amazing. It's great.
Roger : Well...I get to go through the wrestling match, then they show me the holes.
* You're going to go down in history Roger. It's not going to happen for a while. One day when the records are dug up and history is told to fit the truth and people find out what happened in America in the 1990's and 2000.
Roger : Well, the way you learn is by doing.
* Yeah. It can be a fun thing to if you like to learn. Oh. Zeke Layman sends his regards, you know Zeke.
Roger : Yeah. I've even pulled up the last letters I had from Zeke and I haven't answered it here yet, but i've had it laying around. Everytime I try to get near it here, I get just completely blown away from it here for two weeks at a whack.
* Well, he says to say "Hi".
Roger : Yeah, well you tell him the same thing. One of these days here, i'll get to him.
* Yeah. he's up on your stuff too, and learning it.
Roger : Good.
* Saying goodbye.
The End